I see some not impressed with NGC

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Atache
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Aug 04, 2019 3:08 pm

I see some not impressed with NGC

Post by Atache » Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:29 am

NGC does great on MS values in my experience with them in the past. Some graders obviously see different in many cases. Send coin to one company and it is MS-66. Remove the coin from capsule and resubmit to another grading company and get MS-65. Go figure, it turns out to be ones opinion, the grader and the finalist.

I have experienced highs and lows when submitting a coin. I have sent coins in and estimate it would return as MS65-66 and end up with a MS-64. Other times I have sent a coin and expected MS-64-65 and end up with a MS-67 or 68. I do follow some opinions here and admire everyone's input. We all want to see the best in our belongings and another's point of view sets a reality check and with compromise within our own minds we do realize we misjudged our own point of view(s).

I sent these 2 coins to NGC requesting Variety and Mint error,expecting to have the dot below the date recognized on a 1916 Lincoln Cent graded value VG-10 BN and no mention of the Dot. The normal placement of a mint mark would appear down and to the right of the 9 and between the second1. The dot appears below the first one and down to the left of the 9. So it is not a mint mark in my opinion. Unfortunately NGC's point of view did not recognize the dot. The other coin I sent to NGC requesting Variety and Mint error was a 1992 Lincoln Cent which appeared to be double struck obverse and reverse with a Wide AM. I got the coin returned with just the value of MS-63 RB and no mention of doubling or error I see and no indication on the label identifying Wide AM or Close AM. Much disappointment I felt on my end when Heritage Auction was looking for the results of these 2 coins. As someone mentioned PCGS as error experts, I will resubmit to PCGS for a reality check upon my hopes.

I wish no disrespect to any grading company, they do there job as they see it, not us.
I have attached some images of the 2 coins.

Without prejudice Atache
Attachments
1916 Lincoln Penny DOT OBV.jpg
1916 Lincoln Penny DOT OBV.jpg (226.46 KiB) Viewed 670 times
1992 Lincoln Penny OBV.jpg
1992 Lincoln Penny OBV.jpg (283.21 KiB) Viewed 670 times
1992 Lincoln Penny REV.jpg
1992 Lincoln Penny REV.jpg (288.59 KiB) Viewed 670 times
1916 Penny Label.jpg
1916 Penny Label.jpg (329.04 KiB) Viewed 668 times
1992 Penny Label.jpg
1992 Penny Label.jpg (353.99 KiB) Viewed 668 times

Bill in Burl
Posts: 634
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2008 7:41 am
Location: Golden Horseshoe, ONT

Re: I see some not impressed with NGC

Post by Bill in Burl » Fri Oct 18, 2019 5:59 am

This is a Canadian Coin Forum. I'm not too sure that many folks her are up to snuff on US cent errors/varieties. Each of the respected TPG's have slightly different grading standards with more weight given to certain aspects of any coin (fields, luster, cameo, dings, cleaning, etc). Did you pay for the error/variety to be noted on the holder?
Bill in Burl

Atache
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Aug 04, 2019 3:08 pm

Re: I see some not impressed with NGC

Post by Atache » Fri Oct 18, 2019 10:23 am

I did pay for Variety Plus, Mint Error after spending approx. 1 hour on the phone with a representative to clarify to objective I was seeking. The representative had me write on each of the 4 forums I had to return with the coins. They had me write "I think I may have a new Variety, will you recognize?" and "I think I have a New Error, will you recognize?" Requested to write in red ink as per NGC.
The Canadian 1944 Canadian penny I have posted on this site was in the group of coins I sent down along with the 1916 and the 1992 Lincoln Cents. The 1944 Canadian penny was the second time for submission. I sent and posted on all the paper work, "I think I have a new Variety, will you recognize? and I think I have a new Error, will you recognize? This 1944 coin was sent back in its original capsule, appeared as received, never posted as scheduled for grading, never posted in grading or imaging. The coin went from receiving to shipped and was return to me. In the past when I sent a coin to NGC the original tracking number was changed. In other words the coin was removed from original capsule, re-capsuled with new tracking number.
I approached NGC on the grade of the coin via e-mail. The response I got was the grader was not changing there mind. No disrespect to NGC but variety's and mint errors are not their forte. I spent over a $100 USD for the grading of 1944 Canadian penny, not to mention shipping and handling.
The resubmission of the coins will be to another grading company that Heritage Auctions recognize. Don Marino of Heritage Auctions (Senior Numismatist) commented they recognize NGC, PCGS, ANAS. I sent the images of the 3 coins to Heritage Auctions first for an opinion. Don Marino replied via e-mail they were very interested in the coins and to get graded.
To be honest with you all, I had to resubmit 2 of the 1990 Canadian Bare Belly Beavers due to the fact it was over looked. The weird part is that the grading label on a few of the Bare Belly's are on the reverse side and not the Obverse side. I also have a 2019 Equality Dollar (MS-67) graded and the label is on the Reverse vs. the Obverse. No uniformed approach to labeling I was told.
Last edited by Atache on Fri Oct 18, 2019 11:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

troubadour
Posts: 164
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2016 3:46 pm

Re: I see some not impressed with NGC

Post by troubadour » Fri Oct 18, 2019 10:57 am

i dont know about us coins but the 1944 penny error you got isnt recognized by most tpg companies like most die deterioration errors

Atache
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Aug 04, 2019 3:08 pm

Re: I see some not impressed with NGC

Post by Atache » Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:22 pm

I agree with you troubadour that die deterioration is usually not recognized. The 1953 SF Canadian Penny I have posted on this site has hanging 3. Possible triple or quadruple hanging 3. Due to the fact it is not recognized in coin books etc. creates second thoughts to send to NGC. NGC is great when it comes to MS value. To be honest I believe NGC is very accurate when it comes to MS Values of a coin. The variety's an errors I lack confidence in NGC grading team. To think this 1953 SF would come back from NGC as MS value only would be a waste of money, which I am not prepared to re-live another experience with them. I still send coins to NGC, but is limited to seeking MS values only.

momomomo
Posts: 64
Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2009 4:59 pm

Re: I see some not impressed with NGC

Post by momomomo » Sat Oct 19, 2019 3:50 pm

ICCS and CCCS will add the hanging description on their holder.

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